I
wrote about stoning before. In particular, we noticed that stoning, although present in the
Deuteronomy, has been eliminated in Judaism, but not in Islam. I'm sure there are Muslims (the majority I hope?) who are appaled by what some of them are doing, but the crux of the matter is that stoners, e.g. in Iran, are doing so in the name of their god and their law: they justify killing a person in this most brutal manner by convincing themselves that it is their god who told them so, or it is the god who told their lawmakers, and the stoners are acting as agents.
I saw the link and the pictures below in
this blog. I repost it, albeit brutal, because I think we should all be aware of what kind of barbarism humans are capable of, in the absence of rationality, and with the help and support of their religious and political (which are identical in the case of Iran) leaders.
Actual source of graphic images:
National Post. See also article on
Iran's stone age justice system.
Human being always surprises you with their capability of being more brutal than you already could estimate or expect!
ReplyDeleteBeating someone's head with a baton and possibly kill him by smashing his head may not be much less brutal than stoning; if it not be almost as brutal as it, and yet it's not because of a religion but because of your very own benefits; money, power, ...?!
Though religion sometimes can give one the most brutal happenings; the main reason could still remain the human being's capabilities of performing far worse things than even one can imagine!
True, but if religion and laws justify, rather than prohibit, these brutal acts, then people who perform these barbaric acts can find consolation in that they will be rewarded (by the state or by a fictitious heaven) for what they do.
ReplyDeleteYet, you see that almost all world religions endorse wars and many even go further by endorsing hatred. The falacy of religion is that it is a system which can easily be manipulated in order to make any one do anything and be happy with it.
Take, for instance, the number of executions in Texas prisons. Many of the executioners feel that their job (to kill people) is justified by their religion. In fact, the high number of executions in Texas is correlated with the fact that there are many Christian fundamentalists down there (they feel they do the right thing--their god tells them so).
(I'm very much aware of the fact that there are many Christians who disagree with their fellow Christian executioners as there are many Muslims who disagree with their fellow Muslim stoners, but very few of them will do anything to change their religion which is one of the roots of the problem; for instance, Jews should get together and revise the parts of the Torah which are ridiculous or barbaric; however, they claim that the Torah cannot be changed. Nonsense!)
Thanks for the reply. I didn't know about that Texas executions and it strengthens the claim that religions are much from the same nature! Cause the same thing happened under Islamic rules too! And yes, I exactly agree with what you said... I never wanted to excuse the religion! And also what you say about religions justify these brutal act, is the worse part of religions. Most of Muslims believe that Islam is the last and most perfect religion; and yet when you ask them then why this perfect religion can be used to justify lying, killing, raping, ..., they don't have anything to answer, just maybe "this is not the true religion I (we) have in mind!". In fact they accept that religion is 'abusable'!! In general, I myself, never believe in anything that can be abused this massively and widely even if it be really the most great thing in the world!
ReplyDeleteChristianity has been exercised fully before and people had seen what it leads to and then thought they just don't want it; or at least they don't want the churches to rule for them!
Islam in Iran has the same situation; just in Iran people are dealing with religions years after the west, in general, dealt with Christianity. In Iran religion could rule only for a few times, which in other time(s) it didn't show its true face!
**I may shouldn't mention the other countries which has Islam as their main religion (mainly Arab countries) as they still use it and Islam never had been shown to others as a bad thing by media in those countries just because big political powers in the world don't have much problem with them! Still in some of these countries women don't have the right to drive or vote and ploygamy is legal and highly used by men; women are being beaten by their husbands freely in public. Still most of the terrorists are either Arabic/Pakistani but Iran is the main target of terrorism (not that Iran governments doesn't support them though) for USA. Again, I'm not excusing any of those brutal things in Iran; I'm completely opposed to! If USA (west countries in general) had no problem with Iran, then maybe much fewer people knew about these brutal things in Iran by now (no need to mention that Iranians individuals are much more active in defending human rights in rather to people in Arabic countries though)! Stoning is brutal, but what about having no-right for driving/voting for women, polygamy for men, women being beaten by men and ... in those countries?! That's Islam! Stoning alone can be excused by many Muslims, cause it's almost impossible to prove the adultery in Islam to sentence someone to stoning.**
And well, I think that disregarding its reasons, these past 30 years in Iran, what Islam did to itself, were far worse than anything else could do to it in all other years! People are being aware of how less they should trust religions so fast! Soon when they became aware, we may never see these kind of things anymore, although brutal things will still exist IMO! And I think that if religion didn't exist, still another things were existing, making these kind of things legal!
P.S. Though almost half of my argument (between *'s!) is irrelevant to the subject, I wrote them just to prove my stand on religions and that my first comment was not really justifying religions!
Thanks for the reply. I didn't know about that Texas executions and it strengthens the claim that religions are much from the same nature! Cause the same thing happened under Islamic rules too! And yes, I exactly agree with what you said... I never wanted to excuse the religion! And also what you say about religions justify these brutal act, is the worse part of religions. Most of Muslims believe that Islam is the last and most perfect religion; and yet when you ask them then why this perfect religion can be used to justify lying, killing, raping, ..., they don't have anything to answer, just maybe "this is not the true religion I (we) have in mind!". In fact they accept that religion is 'abusable'!! In general, I myself, never believe in anything that can be abused this massively and widely even if it be really the most great thing in the world!
ReplyDeleteChristianity has been exercised fully before and people had seen what it leads to and then thought they just don't want it; or at least they don't want the churches to rule for them!
Islam in Iran has the same situation; just in Iran people are dealing with religions years after the west, in general, dealt with Christianity. In Iran religion could rule only for a few times, which in other time(s) it didn't show its true face!
**I may shouldn't mention the other countries which has Islam as their main religion (mainly Arab countries) as they still use it and Islam never had been shown to others as a bad thing by media in those countries just because big political powers in the world don't have much problem with them! Still in some of these countries women don't have the right to drive or vote and ploygamy is legal and highly used by men; women are being beaten by their husbands freely in public. Still most of the terrorists are either Arabic/Pakistani but Iran is the main target of terrorism (not that Iran governments doesn't support them though) for USA. Again, I'm not excusing any of those brutal things in Iran; I'm completely opposed to! If USA (west countries in general) had no problem with Iran, then maybe much fewer people knew about these brutal things in Iran by now (no need to mention that Iranians individuals are much more active in defending human rights in rather to people in Arabic countries though)! Stoning is brutal, but what about having no-right for driving/voting for women, polygamy for men, women being beaten by men and ... in those countries?! That's Islam! Stoning alone can be excused by many Muslims, cause it's almost impossible to prove the adultery in Islam to sentence someone to stoning.**
And well, I think that disregarding its reasons, these past 30 years in Iran, what Islam did to itself, were far worse than anything else could do to it in all other years! People are being aware of how less they should trust religions so fast! Soon when they became aware, we may never see these kind of things anymore, although brutal things will still exist IMO! And I think that if religion didn't exist, still another things were existing, making these kind of things legal!
P.S. Though almost half of my argument (between *'s!) is irrelevant to the subject, I wrote them just to prove my stand on religions and that my first comment was not really justifying religions!
Thanks for the reply. I didn't know about that Texas executions and it strengthens the claim that religions are much from the same nature! Cause the same thing happened under Islamic rules too! And yes, I exactly agree with what you said... I never wanted to excuse the religion! And also what you say about religions justify these brutal act, is the worse part of religions. Most of Muslims believe that Islam is the last and most perfect religion; and yet when you ask them then why this perfect religion can be used to justify lying, killing, raping, ..., they don't have anything to answer, just maybe "this is not the true religion I (we) have in mind!". In fact they accept that religion is 'abusable'!! In general, I myself, never believe in anything that can be abused this massively and widely even if it be really the most great thing in the world!
ReplyDeleteChristianity has been exercised fully before and people had seen what it leads to and then thought they just don't want it; or at least they don't want the churches to rule for them!
Islam in Iran has the same situation; just in Iran people are dealing with religions years after the west, in general, dealt with Christianity. In Iran religion could rule only for a few times, which in other time(s) it didn't show its true face!
**I may shouldn't mention the other countries which has Islam as their main religion (mainly Arab countries) as they still use it and Islam never had been shown to others as a bad thing by media in those countries just because big political powers in the world don't have much problem with them! Still in some of these countries women don't have the right to drive or vote and ploygamy is legal and highly used by men; women are being beaten by their husbands freely in public. Still most of the terrorists are either Arabic/Pakistani but Iran is the main target of terrorism (not that Iran governments doesn't support them though) for USA. Again, I'm not excusing any of those brutal things in Iran; I'm completely opposed to! No need to mention that Iranians individuals are much more active in defending human rights in rather to people in Arabic countries though! Stoning alone can be excused by many Muslims, cause it's almost impossible to prove the adultery in Islam to sentence someone to stoning.**
And well, I think that disregarding its reasons, these past 30 years in Iran, what Islam did to itself, were far worse than anything else could do to it in all other years! People are being aware of how less they should trust religions so fast! Soon when they became aware, we may never see these kind of things anymore, although brutal things will still exist IMO! And I think that if religion didn't exist, still another things were existing, making these kind of things legal!
P.S. Though almost half of my argument (between *'s!) is irrelevant to the subject, I wrote them just to prove my stand on religions and that my first comment was not really justifying religions!
Thanks for the reply. I didn't know about that Texas executions and it strengthens the claim that religions are much from the same nature! Cause the same thing happened under Islamic rules too! And yes, I exactly agree with what you said... I never wanted to excuse the religion! And also what you say about religions justify these brutal act, is the worse part of religions. Most of Muslims believe that Islam is the last and most perfect religion; and yet when you ask them then why this perfect religion can be used to justify lying, killing, raping, ..., they don't have anything to answer, just maybe "this is not the true religion I (we) have in mind!". In fact they accept that religion is 'abusable'!! In general, I myself, never believe in anything that can be abused this massively and widely even if it be really the most great thing in the world!
ReplyDeleteChristianity has been exercised fully before and people had seen what it leads to and then thought they just don't want it; or at least they don't want the churches to rule for them!
Islam in Iran has the same situation; just in Iran people are dealing with religions years after the west, in general, dealt with Christianity. In Iran religion could rule only for a few times, which in other time(s) it didn't show its true face!
**I may shouldn't mention the other countries which has Islam as their main religion (mainly Arab countries) as they still use it and Islam never had been shown to others as a bad thing by media in those countries just because big political powers in the world don't have much problem with them! Still in some of these countries women don't have the right to drive or vote and ploygamy is legal and highly used by men; women are being beaten by their husbands freely in public. Still most of the terrorists are either Arabic/Pakistani but Iran is the main target of terrorism (not that Iran governments doesn't support them though) for USA. Again, I'm not excusing any of those brutal things in Iran; I'm completely opposed to! If USA (west countries in general) had no problem with Iran, then maybe much fewer people knew about these brutal things in Iran by now (no need to mention that Iranians individuals are much more active in defending human rights in rather to people in Arabic countries though)! Stoning is brutal, but what about having no-right for driving/voting for women, polygamy for men, women being beaten by men and ... in those countries?! That's Islam! Stoning alone can be excused by many Muslims, cause it's almost impossible to prove the adultery in Islam to sentence someone to stoning.**
And well, I think that disregarding its reasons, these past 30 years in Iran, what Islam did to itself, were far worse than anything else could do to it in all other years! People are being aware of how less they should trust religions so fast! Soon when they became aware, we may never see these kind of things anymore, although brutal things will still exist IMO! And I think that if religion didn't exist, still another things were existing, making these kind of things legal!
P.S. Though almost half of my argument (between *'s!) is irrelevant to the subject, I wrote them to show my stand on religions.
Thanks for the info. I didn't know about that Texas executions and it strengthens the claim that religions are much from the same nature! Cause the same thing happened under Islamic rules too! I exactly agree with what you said... I never wanted to excuse the religion! What you say about religions justify these brutal act, is the worse part of religions. Most of Muslims believe that Islam is the last and most perfect religion; and yet when you ask them then why this perfect religion can be used to justify lying, killing, raping, ..., they don't have anything to answer, just maybe "this is not the true religion I (we) have in mind!". In fact they accept that religion is 'abusable'!! I myself, never believe in anything that can be abused this massively and widely even if it be really the most great thing in the world!
ReplyDeleteChristianity has been exercised fully before and people had seen what it leads to and then thought they just don't want it; or at least they don't want the churches to rule for them!
Islam in Iran has the same situation now.
**I may shouldn't mention the other countries which has Islam as their main religion (mainly Arab countries) and Islam never had been shown to others as a bad thing by media in those countries just because big political powers in the world don't have much problem with them! In some of these countries women don't have the right to drive or vote and ploygamy is legal and highly used by men; women are being beaten by their husbands freely in public and ... Again, I'm not excusing any of those brutal things in Iran; I'm completely opposed to! If USA (west countries in general) had no problem with Iran, then maybe much fewer people knew about these brutal things in Iran by now (no need to mention that Iranians individuals are much more active in defending human rights in rather to other islamic countries though)! Stoning is brutal, but what about the other things in those countries?! That's Islam! Stoning alone can be excused by many Muslims, cause it's almost impossible to prove the adultery in Islam to sentence someone to stoning.**
And well, I think that disregarding its reasons, these past 30 years in Iran, what Islam did to itself, were far worse than anything else could do to it in all other years! People are being aware of how less they should trust religions so fast! Soon when they became aware, we may never see these kind of things anymore, although brutal things will still exist IMO! And I think that if religion didn't exist, still another things were existing, making these kind of things legal!
P.S. Though almost half of my argument (between *'s!) is irrelevant to the subject, I wrote them just to prove my stand on religions and that my first comment was not really justifying religions!
Thanks for the reply. I didn't know about that Texas executions and it strengthens the claim that religions are much from the same nature! Cause the same thing happened under Islamic rules too! And yes, I exactly agree with what you said... I never wanted to excuse the religion! And also what you say about religions justify these brutal act, is the worse part of religions. Most of Muslims believe that Islam is the last and most perfect religion; and yet when you ask them then why this perfect religion can be used to justify lying, killing, raping, ..., they don't have anything to answer, just maybe "this is not the true religion I (we) have in mind!". In fact they accept that religion is 'abusable'!! In general, I myself, never believe in anything that can be abused this massively and widely even if it be really the most great thing in the world!
ReplyDeleteChristianity has been exercised fully before and people had seen what it leads to and then thought they just don't want it; or at least they don't want the churches to rule for them!
Islam in Iran has the same situation; just in Iran people are dealing with religions years after the west, in general, dealt with Christianity. In Iran religion could rule only for a few times, which in other time(s) it didn't show its true face!
And well, I think that disregarding its reasons, these past 30 years in Iran, what Islam did to itself, were far worse than anything else could do to it in all other years! People are being aware of how less they should trust religions so fast! Soon when they became aware, we may never see these kind of things anymore, although brutal things will still exist IMO! And I think that if religion didn't exist, still another things were existing, making these kind of things legal!
P.S. I almost deleted half of my argument because it was irrelevant to the subject, I will post them in next comment so if you liked you can read!
I may shouldn't mention the other countries which has Islam as their main religion (mainly Arab countries) as they still use it and Islam never had been shown to others as a bad thing by media in those countries just because big political powers in the world don't have much problem with them! Still in some of these countries women don't have the right to drive or vote and ploygamy is legal and highly used by men; women are being beaten by their husbands freely in public. Still most of the terrorists are either Arabic/Afghan/Pakistani but Iran is the main target of terrorism (not that Iran governments doesn't support them though) for USA. Again, I'm not excusing any of those brutal things in Iran; I'm completely opposed to! If USA (west countries in general) had no problem with Iran, then maybe much fewer people knew about these brutal things in Iran by now (no need to mention that Iranians individuals are much more active in defending human rights in rather to people in most of the other Islamic countries though)! Stoning is brutal, but what about having no-right for driving/voting for women, polygamy for men, women being beaten by men and ... in those countries?! That's Islam! Stoning alone can be excused by many Muslims, cause it's almost impossible to prove the adultery in Islam to sentence someone to stoning.
ReplyDeletewow, it was giving an error every time I was trying to submit the comment, and now it seems it actually submitted all!
ReplyDeleteYes,stoning is horrible. Executing is horrible. Though we shouldn't forget about all those sexual abuses by Catholic priests (most of the media doesn't know about...) or the power of the destructive words on religious people,most effectively on children. Religious leaders who speak of adultery,lying or cheating but they themselves living them day by day.Are we;Christians,at least baptised to be... ; doing anything against them,make them stop??? No,not much at all! Then how should we expect of Muslims change their religion or religious leaders? Wouldn't it be a help to show them a good model-us changing our own first? This isn't a job for individuals,though we can contribute with our small steps ,we can only achieve big results by "fighting" LOUDLY together.Iranian youngsters,as I see, are more and more open-minded.They are willing to change their religion,laws. They watch us westerners.
ReplyDeleteYes,Parham,Persian women have much more rights than women in many Arabic countries.The problem is,these women don't know-in most cases- what rights they could/should have. And this fact makes me as sad as reading about stoning.